>> well, the obama administration has changed a number of things. and we have reason to believe that by executive order they -- that things are better. >> bill: that we're no longer engaging in torture? >> not that we can tell right now. the problem is this is done by executive order. it can be changed. we think the congress needs to come in, look at the laws, close the loopholes and make it very, very difficult if not impossible for future governments to come in and say torture is the thing we want to do. >> bill: now i have a question why you need a new law when there are already laws on the books. before we go to break, i doubt that your commission got into this question. i have to ask it. if we know that members of our government knowingly broke the law, why shouldn't they be held responsible and accountable for breaking the law? >> i think that's a good question. we did not get into that. as a panel, did not want to get into making those kinds of accusations. however, i think it is very important that the classified information be made public a